[Community_garden] Giant hostas and coffee grounds

Kirby, Ellen ellenkirby at bbg.org
Wed Feb 21 12:25:32 EST 2007 

How about some anecdotal information from gardener's who've used coffee
grounds (or did this happen earlier and I missed it)?  The gardener for
City Hall in NYC swears that hostas there are the biggest in the world
by putting grounds straight  around the plants (in moderation of
course). 

Ellen Kirby

-----Original Message-----
From: community_garden-bounces at list.communitygarden.org
[mailto:community_garden-bounces at list.communitygarden.org] On Behalf Of
Mike McGrath
Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2007 9:51 AM
To: Ray Schutte; community_garden at list.communitygarden.org;
yarrow at sfo.com
Subject: [Community_garden] The Great Koffee Kontroversy


right--you sent that lab result before.
    And the Director of Wood's End, a highly respected soil lab (they
have 
been testing composts for municipalities and organic production for
decades) 
very recently told me that they've tested 30 some samples of grounds
from 
production facilities over the years and always got an initial pH of
around 
5. He ran a test on their break room's grounds for me this winter and
got 
5.1. He also noted that some samples that tested neutral were later
found to 
have been composted with other materials.
    So we're trying to figure it out--and not from one source (the more
I 
think about it, the more I wonder if that Washington State one might
have 
been my own original reason for believing the grounds to be neutral).
    I think Don is right on the money about the type of coffee and
brewing 
process having an influence. Heck I'll even speculate that the time
between 
brewing and testing may be a factor.
    So let's figure it all out; its fun and should make a great story.
    C'mon kids--break out those pH meters and send us some numbers!
                                        ----Mike McG

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ray Schutte" <rayschutte at comcast.net>
To: "'Mike McGrath'" <MikeMcG at PTD.net>; 
<community_garden at list.communitygarden.org>; <yarrow at sfo.com>
Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 11:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Community_garden] coffee grounds are HIGHLY acidic


>I have been using coffee grounds along with selected browns as a mulch 
>for  years.  I have my soil tested regularly and have not found an 
>acidity  problem here in the Pacific Northwest know for a certain level

>of acidity.  I have found the following to be trustworthy.
>
> Starbucks commissioned a study in 1995
> to better understand the make up of the
> organic matter we call coffee grounds. The
> following is the result of the analysis
> performed by the University of Washington,
> College of Forest Resources:
>
> Primary Nutrients
> Nitrogen 1.45%
> Phosphorus ND ug/g
> Potassium 1204 ug/g
> Secondary Nutrients
> Calcium 389 ug/g
> Magnesium 448 ug/g
> Sulfur high ug/g
> Terms: ND = indicates sample is below
> detection limit
> ug/g= microgram / gram
>
> Most of the acidity in coffee is removed
> during the brewing process. Used grounds
> have an average pH of 6.9. Use your
> grounds within 3 weeks to capture the
> most nutritional value.
>
>
> Ray Schutte
>
> "The truth of the matter is that the flower has cleverly manipulated 
> the
> bee
> into hauling its pollen from blossom to blossom." The Botany of
Desire,
> Michael Pollan
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: community_garden-bounces at list.communitygarden.org
> [mailto:community_garden-bounces at list.communitygarden.org] On Behalf 
> Of
> Mike
> McGrath
> Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 6:42 AM
> To: community_garden at list.communitygarden.org; yarrow at sfo.com
> Subject: [Community_garden] coffee grounds are HIGHLY acidic
>
> My bad! I was one of the people guilty of spreading the 'coffee 
> grounds
> are
> neutral' news for several years; luckily, I eventually followed up
with 
> more
>
> research.  Wood's End Lab has confirmed that coffee grounds are VERY
> acidic;
>
> here's the very interesting details: 
> http://www.gardensalive.com/article.asp?ai=793
>                                        Best to all, Mike McG
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <yarrow at sfo.com>
> To: <community_garden at list.communitygarden.org>
> Sent: Monday, February 19, 2007 10:10 PM
> Subject: Re: [Community_garden] Lime, worms and flies
>
>
>> Don wrote:
>>>Interestingly, coffee grounds would do the opposite of
>>>lime chemically, making conditions too acidic. But
>>>worms don't like them, either - I did an experimental
>>>trial of large amounts of coffeegrounds as sole
>>>foodstock, with newspaper as bedding, in wormbins, and
>>>the results were a complete bust (small amounts of
>>>grounds are fine).
>>
>> Acidic coffee grounds? That's a common myth. In fact, although coffee

>> itself is acidic, used coffee grounds are neutral.
>>
>> _____ http://faq.gardenweb.com/faq/lists/soil/2002015354019975.html
>>
>> While it is widely thought that they are acidic it has been shown 
>> that most of this acidity is removed in the brewing process. Used 
>> grounds are essentialy neutral and composting them with other 
>> materials will buffer any minor residual acidity.
>>
>> One of the forum regulars with a scientific background did some 
>> controlled chemistry experiments on the acidity question and this is 
>> what he had to say:
>>
>> "Roasted coffee is fairly acidic, but it appears that almost all of 
>> the acid is water soluble and is extracted during brewing. Used 
>> grounds have essentially neutral pH, although the coffee beverage 
>> produced is rather acidic.
>>
>> The measured pH of used coffee grounds was 6.9, with a significant 
>> amount of buffer capacity - adding the coffee to either acidic or 
>> basic solutions drove both towards neutral pH. The exact pH of used 
>> grounds will depend on the pH and alkalinity of the water used in 
>> brewing, but with any potable water, used grounds will be close to 
>> neutral pH." _____
>>
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