[Community_garden] Sandbag that garden! - And retreads...
Mike McGrath
MikeMcG at PTD.net
Tue Mar 18 11:55:39 EDT 2008
I like this idea a lot; my earliest raised beds were framed with felled
black locusts from Bob Rodale's alley-cropping crop at his famed Working
Tree Farm...
---McG
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jack Hale" <jackh at knoxparks.org>
To: <community_garden at list.communitygarden.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2008 11:24 AM
Subject: Re: [Community_garden] Sandbag that garden! - And retreads...
> Don's rant about squares and rectangles reminded me of the lovely
> curving beds made of wattle at the Edible Schoolyard in Berkeley.
> Children at the school harvested green branches, drove some of the
> heftier ones into the ground to create the shape they wanted and then
> created basket weave walls with long, thin, pliable sticks. My
> understanding was that they would last a few seasons, anyway. They are
> cheap, flexible, easily repaired, renewable, charming, organic, etc.
> JH
>
>
> Jack N. Hale
> Executive Director
> Knox Parks Foundation
> 75 Laurel Street
> Hartford, CT 06106
> 860/951-7694
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: community_garden-bounces at list.communitygarden.org
> [mailto:community_garden-bounces at list.communitygarden.org] On Behalf Of
> Don Boekelheide
> Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2008 11:05 AM
> To: community_garden at list.communitygarden.org
> Cc: felder at felderrushing.net; harristakoma at erols.com; Mike McGrath
> Subject: Re: [Community_garden] Sandbag that garden! - And retreads...
>
> Hey, all,
>
> Much as I hate to admit it, Mike's right - I mean, it is obvious, the
> first thing I did at Urban Ministry was put in some...that's right ...
> raised beds. Round jobbies made of masonry not wooden boxes, but still.
> You already know my official reasons, to give tired homeless folks a
> place to sit and rest, and and having to garden in an area of compacted
> crappy soil without drainage, but reading Mike's post I realised there
> was another factor - I needed instant "something to look at" aka
> "success". Now, it isn't sustainable gardening success, that only comes
> with years of daily practice doing gardening. Just like meditation (the
> two are closely related, at least in my mind). But boxes, planters,
> whatever ,do give you something to show the community, the folks, and
> the funders. We got those beds in place in a couple weeks, stuck in some
> pansies, put up homemade prayer banners on conduit poles 10 ft tall to
> catch the wind, and when 'official' opening day came the 'garden
> program' was a smash hit.
>
> But I still don't like boxes. Treasure of the Sierra Madre attitude:
> "Boxes? We don't need no stinkin' boxes..." But I'll use 'em when they
> can help.
>
> But be careful, folks. Three things to consider:
>
> * Watch the budget, since wood and fill soil can both get very expensive
> very fast. A local well-heeled, well-meaning non-profit just burned up
> $3000 to build six modest boxo beds at a single school and fill them
> with purchased soil. That's three !#@$% GRAND! That's enough to fund my
> program for months!
>
> * Don't make the box the end when it is really only the beginning. All
> the ACGA stuff about working with people and building community, and all
> the hort stuff that garden-types like me rant on about - you've got to
> pay attention to all that. Watering. Weeding. Planting with the seasons.
> Who will do the work? Also, keeping fill/potting soils fertile and
> healthy can be a challenge. Ask yourself how the box will look under a
> worst case scenario. If you aren't pretty sure you can avoid that, I'd
> avoid the box (not the garden - just the box).
>
> And think about squares. Boxes are little houses, squared off extensions
> of our built environment. Meanwhile, nature curves and dances. Boxes are
> purchased. Nature can't be purchased. It's a question of deeper
> aesthetics, and how much our garden design is based on fear of nature
> and a desire to control it and put it in a box, as opposed to embracing
> and celebrating the natural world. I'm not saying either approach is
> right or wrong, but suggesting that it makes sense to stay ever mindful
> of wider perspectives in our rush to accomplish things, and make the
> world a better place through our particular garden projects.
>
> (btw, building boxes to the golden section rectangle/Fibonacci sequence
> dimensions strikes me as monumental silliness, though that's in vogue
> right now. At a recent garden conference, I heard a garden writer I
> otherwise much admire go wandering into this swamp - and all the slides
> in her PowerPoint were sized 1:1.618. Inspiring. Cosmic. I just hope she
> runs into Pogo in that swamp, before it's too late).
>
> Now - the real reason for this post is that I forgot a very important
> container option. After my kids got on the schoolbus early this morning,
> an old red pickup with a shotgun cross the back window and a NASCAR
> bumper sticker came cruising through the neighborhood, looking for me.
> They were going to take away my Dixie ID and either make me leave
> Carolina or wear a Yankee button on my baseball cap. Why? I neglected to
> mention old tires. They are a traditional planter material down here.
> Sure, they have some problems, but what else are we going to do with
> them? If they are good enough for Felder Rushing's planters, they're
> good enough for me. Check it out:
> http://www.felderrushing.net/frontyard.htm
>
> Don
> http://urbanministrygarden.wordpress.com
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Mike McGrath <MikeMcG at PTD.net>
> To: Don Boekelheide <dboekelheide at yahoo.com>;
> community_garden at list.communitygarden.org
> Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2008 10:07:51 AM
> Subject: Sandbag that garden!
>
> I disagree with my good friend Don about the usefulness of raised beds.
> I find them to be a great solution to crappy conditions. (And Don--a lot
> of those flat-earth ancestors didn't make it past 35. And the Native
> Americans largely ate what nature grew for them.)
>
> BUT I want to thank Don for a great idea mentioned later--raised beds
> framed by sandbags! You just need to bring the empty bags to the site,
> then you can fill them with the crappy stuff you're trying not to grow
> in. Bravo, Donnie Boy!~
>
> (As Abbie Hoffman once said, I will Steal This Tip!)
>
> ---Mike McG
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Don Boekelheide" <dboekelheide at yahoo.com>
> To: <community_garden at list.communitygarden.org>
> Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 9:36 PM
> Subject: Re: [Community_garden] Trex or other building material
>
>
>> I'm afraid I too agree that, in my experience, building boxes isn't
>> usually necessary for gardening (even out in Colorado, admittedly a
>> challenging place in your higher, drier areas). I grant you that
>> containers made of anything - wood, masonry, plastic, brick, clay,
> trex,
>> ferro-cement, cardboard, old kids' plastic swimming pools, etc, etc -
> are
>> good in some special circumstances for holding soil, improving
> drainage,
>> etc. They also clearly define areas, which some folks prefer
>> aesthetically. But they add an additional level of expense (sometimes,
> a
>> lot of expense) and futzing, and come with a whole new set of problems
>
>> like potential toxicity of some materials, rotting out, and
> maintenance.
>> And when they are abandoned or go weedy - at a school, for instance,
> over
>> the summer - they can look pretty awful and become a strong visual
>> argument for why it makes no sense to fund or support garden projects.
>>
>> So, are you _sure_ you don't just want to garden? Have you considered
>> looking for a suitable spot for a community garden, for instance? Save
>
>> some open space, build soil, etc. Work together. Build community, not
>> little boxes (...on the hillside, as Malvina used to sing...).
>>
>> If you are very sure, though, that you want to make boxes, I agree
> that
>> masonry is a very useful option to consider, rather than wood or trex.
>
>> I've used blocks very successfully at Urban Ministry (where I mostly
>> needed something for tired folks to sit on, but also in one particular
>
>> spot had horrible drainage), and in other sites. The option from Lowes
>
>> Depot I like best are 4x8x16 solid concrete blocks. If the project
>> doesn't work out, these blocks are reasonably easy to remove, reform
> or
>> recycle.
>>
>> Another option, if you are growing food, are "pillow packs" made very
>> simply by filling big black plastic sacks with soil mix. There are
> fancier
>> 'grow bags' that commercial nurseries use - both these options might
> be
>> interesting under xeric conditions. They won't win any beauty pagents
> and
>> plastic has all kinds of problems, but I've seen them used very
>> successfully to produce quite a bit of food.
>>
>> Last but not least, what are the local containers that you have there
>> traditionally? What did the first settlers build with, or the First
>> Nations peoples who were there before? How did they garden? Rather
> than
>> start with boxes - and we all have garden books and mags full of pics
> of
>> boxes to inspire us - why not, er, think outside the box?
>>
>> Don
>> http://urbanministrygarden.wordpress.com
>> (I have some pics of the Urban Ministry masonry beds on the blog, if
> you'd
>> like to see. They are done with 'landscape' blocks with round edges, a
>
>> donation from a local soils and mulch company, Blue Max).
>>
>>
>>
>> From: community_garden-bounces at list.communitygarden.org
>> [mailto:community_garden-bounces at list.communitygarden.org] On Behalf
> Of
>> GivenTrees at aol.com
>> Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 8:50 AM
>> To: community_garden at list.communitygarden.org
>> Subject: [Community_garden] Trex or other building material
>>
>> Hey all, I'm looking for material to build raised beds, cold frames
>> etc. to
>> grow organic veggies in. Trying NOT to cut any trees or use
>> traditional
>> lumber material. I've always heard redwood was the best wood to use,
>> but looking
>> for alternatives. I think there had been a discussion here before
>> about
>> Trex, is there any leaching? Down sides? Alternatives? Suggestions?
>> Thanks Tina
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -------------- next part --------------
>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>> URL:
>>
> http://list.communitygarden.org/pipermail/community_garden_list.communit
> ygarden.org/attachments/20080317/ed965fe4/attachment.html
>> _______________________________________________
>> The American Community Gardening Association listserve is only one of
>> ACGA's services to community gardeners. To learn more about the ACGA
> and
>> to find out how to join, please go to http://www.communitygarden.org
>>
>> To post an e-mail to the list:
> community_garden at list.communitygarden.org
>>
>> To subscribe, unsubscribe or change your subscription:
>>
> http://list.communitygarden.org/mailman/listinfo/community_garden_list.c
> ommunitygarden.org
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
> http://list.communitygarden.org/pipermail/community_garden_list.communit
> ygarden.org/attachments/20080318/ac7cd117/attachment.html
> _______________________________________________
> The American Community Gardening Association listserve is only one of
> ACGA's services to community gardeners. To learn more about the ACGA and
> to find out how to join, please go to http://www.communitygarden.org
>
> To post an e-mail to the list:
> community_garden at list.communitygarden.org
>
> To subscribe, unsubscribe or change your subscription:
> http://list.communitygarden.org/mailman/listinfo/community_garden_list.c
> ommunitygarden.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> The American Community Gardening Association listserve is only one of
> ACGA's services to community gardeners. To learn more about the ACGA and
> to find out how to join, please go to http://www.communitygarden.org
>
> To post an e-mail to the list: community_garden at list.communitygarden.org
>
> To subscribe, unsubscribe or change your subscription:
> http://list.communitygarden.org/mailman/listinfo/community_garden_list.communitygarden.org
>
>
More information about the Community_garden
mailing list